Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Discuss the art of creating art here. Share tutorials and tips with your fellow comic creators.

Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby TheJGamer » May 30th, 2018, 8:57 pm

Hello, SJ! I've recently decided to start drawing little cartoons with colored pencils and an Ultra Fine Sharpie for the inking portion. There's some questions about it that I want to ask before I delve deeper into it:

-First off, is Ultra Fine Sharpie a good inking tool? I saw on YouTube that any cheap permanent marker will serve as an effective inking tool, so I just want to make sure that I have the right pen for the job.
-What kind of paper prevents bleeding from happening? I obviously don't want the lineart to bleed through the paper.
-How long does it take for an Ultra Fine Sharpie to dry? Back when I drew with pens, I sometimes erased the pencil sketch too early, causing the pen lineart to be smudged, which is something I don't want happening.
-Does colored pencils work well with Ultra Fine Sharpie? The artist that I was inspired by (Thomas Romain is his name, you should go check him out) uses watercolor with permanent marker lineart, but since I don't have watercolors at the moment, I thought that colored pencils would serve as a good alternative.

Thank you!
Just some kid who likes to draw and sprite. Thinking of starting a comic and actually sticking with it.
User avatar
TheJGamer
 
Posts: 172
Joined: October 17th, 2016, 11:16 pm
Location: USA

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby Oly-RRR » May 30th, 2018, 9:16 pm

First off, is Ultra Fine Sharpie a good inking tool? I saw on YouTube that any cheap permanent marker will serve as an effective inking tool, so I just want to make sure that I have the right pen for the job.
I have a couple of Ultra Fine Sharpies and honestly I really dislike them as a drawing tool and only use them when I need to write something in permanent marker. I have a friend who uses them for art though but they admit they bleed through pretty much everything and are best used for quick exercises as way to make it impossible to fret over mistakes and tweak stuff. I might be wrong but I haven't heard of anyone using them for inking on a regular basis.

If you want the most cost-effective inking tool I'd suggest getting a bottle of Indian ink and a nib pen with a pointy end. If you feel intimidated by nibs (they are actually fairly quick to get used to but I can understand the feeling, I avoided nibs for too long) Faber-Castell or Sakura Micron liners are a slightly more costly alternative.

My currently favourite inking tool is Pentel brushpens (FP10 or any calligraphy brush) but that's not the cheapest option... Though you can refill FP10 cartridges with your own ink (there are instructions for this on Youtube) and it only slightly affects performance.

What kind of paper prevents bleeding from happening? I obviously don't want the lineart to bleed through the paper.
Sharpies will bleed through ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING. Experimenting with mixed media paper is worth a shot but I can't think of any specific brand.

How long does it take for an Ultra Fine Sharpie to dry? Back when I drew with pens, I sometimes erased the pencil sketch too early, causing the pen lineart to be smudged, which is something I don't want happening.
I think they dry fairly quickly (less than a minute?) but in my opinion you're better off not using Sharpies in the first place and taking a break from inking 30 minutes will prevent smudging with most pens and is just a good habit as it lets you have a fresh look at your drawing.

Does colored pencils work well with Ultra Fine Sharpie?
From what I understand all colour pencils are compatible with inks, you only need to worry about this if you start colouring with markers or watercolours.
Image
Image
You can't compare shooting a stag with lasers to putting on women's clothing!!! - Liz Carr on Ouch!
You know you're overweight when your stab-vest starts riding up and looking a bit like a crop-top... - Alfie Moore
User avatar
Oly-RRR
 
Posts: 1887
Joined: August 20th, 2012, 6:36 pm
Location: here for the music

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby eishiya » May 30th, 2018, 10:40 pm

Sharpies are usable, but you'll have a much nicer time with some drawing pens. Sakura Microns are comparable in price to Ultra Fine Sharpies, but come in more sizes and don't bleed as much. I haven't compared the drying times, but Microns probably dry faster since they don't soak your paper with ink.

There are two kinds of bleeding: bleed-through where the ink soaks through to the other side, and the kind where the ink spreads outward from your stroke via capillary action, making your lines look fuzzy.
Bleed-through is prevented mostly by paper thickness, though coatings also help. The fuzzy bleeding depends on the texture of the paper, there's usually less bleeding on smooth paper. Bristol board and vellum are great for ink, as they're thick and smooth, but they're also pricy. Both kinds of bleeding are also prevented/reduced by minimizing the amount of ink on the paper by using a small number of quick, light strokes instead of a bunch of slow, heavy ones; working this way can allow you to make bleed-free artwork on cheap printer paper.

The interaction between ink and pencils depends on the order you use them in and the exact materials you use. If you ink first, just about any coloured pencils will work, but colouring over inked lines makes the lines duller, and on some papers, can smudge the ink even if it's dry. If you ink over your pencils to get more contrasting lines, then it depends on whether the pencils are waxy, many inks glob up on contact with oils. I'm not sure which pencils are waxy and which aren't, but I recall Prismacolors not taking ink well.
Image
User avatar
eishiya
 
Posts: 9398
Joined: December 5th, 2009, 11:17 am

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby TheJGamer » May 30th, 2018, 10:50 pm

Thanks for the answers! Should have known that Ultra Fine Sharpies bleed sooner! I'll get my parents to return the Ultra Fine Sharpies and shop for the pens that have been suggested. Might get the Sakura Microns since they look nice.

I've also become aware of Sharpie Pens; they are supposed to be just like Ultra Fine Sharpies, but come with the advantage that they don't bleed. Could that also be an alternative?
Just some kid who likes to draw and sprite. Thinking of starting a comic and actually sticking with it.
User avatar
TheJGamer
 
Posts: 172
Joined: October 17th, 2016, 11:16 pm
Location: USA

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby kayotics » May 31st, 2018, 9:24 am

hold up there. I actually use the Ultra Fine Sharpies on pretty much every page I do.

First off, is Ultra Fine Sharpie a good inking tool? I saw on YouTube that any cheap permanent marker will serve as an effective inking tool, so I just want to make sure that I have the right pen for the job.
eishiya's point about Microns being a better drawing pen is true, but I actually use both. I use the Ultra Fine Sharpie in nearly all of my pages, generally for detail work that doesn't need to be super fine. (I also don't go for really tiny lines, so the sharpie is good for that). One thing I prefer with the sharpie is that it holds more ink, whereas the microns I have a harder time keeping nice.

What kind of paper prevents bleeding from happening? I obviously don't want the lineart to bleed through the paper.
Bristol paper. I use Strathmore brand paper, and they've got some comic-ready printed pages, but if you find another brand that works for you, go for it. Bristol paper will prevent most bleeding, though. The ultra fine sharpies do bleed outward on some lesser-quality paper, but they bleed less than copic markers, so any copic quality paper will be fine for the sharpies.

How long does it take for an Ultra Fine Sharpie to dry? Back when I drew with pens, I sometimes erased the pencil sketch too early, causing the pen lineart to be smudged, which is something I don't want happening.
I wait probably like 30 minutes to be safe. I try to leave it for as long as I can, or to work on some other sections of the page that I'm using brush pens or a faster drying ink on.

Does colored pencils work well with Ultra Fine Sharpie? The artist that I was inspired by (Thomas Romain is his name, you should go check him out) uses watercolor with permanent marker lineart, but since I don't have watercolors at the moment, I thought that colored pencils would serve as a good alternative.
Colored pencils should work with pretty much any of your markers of choice, especially if you're adding it on later. They're usually not waxy, and it's the water from watercolors that you'd have to be concerned with, since that could cause bleeding. If you plan to use watercolors, consider using watercolor paper. eishiya also covered a lot of this, too.

Ultimately, whether or not you like the ultra fine sharpies depends on you. I use them extensively, but clearly other people don't like them as much. Try them out on some small illustrations, and see how it works for you.
Image
User avatar
kayotics
 
Posts: 157
Joined: January 29th, 2018, 9:57 pm

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby Oly-RRR » May 31st, 2018, 9:51 pm

kayotics wrote:I use them extensively, but clearly other people don't like them as much. Try them out on some small illustrations, and see how it works for you.

I'm starting to wonder where I went wrong with Sharpies because your lineart is great! Though I keep trying different paper instead of sticking with Bristol (it's pricey and hard to find here, and when it comes to illustrations and doodles I actually like switching between different kinds of paper) so maybe that's why. Or it's a matter of preferences entirely, I just genuinely haven't met anyone recommending Sharpies for comics until now. :)
Image
Image
You can't compare shooting a stag with lasers to putting on women's clothing!!! - Liz Carr on Ouch!
You know you're overweight when your stab-vest starts riding up and looking a bit like a crop-top... - Alfie Moore
User avatar
Oly-RRR
 
Posts: 1887
Joined: August 20th, 2012, 6:36 pm
Location: here for the music

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby TheJGamer » June 1st, 2018, 10:42 pm

Oh nice, kayotics! Thank you for your input!

I just used my first Ultra Fine Sharpie to ink a small doodle. Besides being a pain in the ass to open, they're pretty easy to work with. I did screw up once or twice because of nervousness, but otherwise, I think the final product will look great!
Just some kid who likes to draw and sprite. Thinking of starting a comic and actually sticking with it.
User avatar
TheJGamer
 
Posts: 172
Joined: October 17th, 2016, 11:16 pm
Location: USA

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby AltCat » June 2nd, 2018, 10:21 am

TheJGamer wrote:-How long does it take for an Ultra Fine Sharpie to dry? Back when I drew with pens, I sometimes erased the pencil sketch too early, causing the pen lineart to be smudged, which is something I don't want happening.


Not tried a lightboard?

Apart from not having to erase of course, I find it also makes the sketching better since not thinking about being light on the hand instead.
Image
User avatar
AltCat
 
Posts: 50
Joined: November 5th, 2017, 10:26 am

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby kayotics » June 2nd, 2018, 11:40 am

Oly-RRR wrote:
kayotics wrote:I use them extensively, but clearly other people don't like them as much. Try them out on some small illustrations, and see how it works for you.

I'm starting to wonder where I went wrong with Sharpies because your lineart is great! Though I keep trying different paper instead of sticking with Bristol (it's pricey and hard to find here, and when it comes to illustrations and doodles I actually like switching between different kinds of paper) so maybe that's why. Or it's a matter of preferences entirely, I just genuinely haven't met anyone recommending Sharpies for comics until now. :)

Thank you! I think it just takes a lot of time and patience to learn to use Sharpies as a tool. I've seen people do gorgeous things with Crayola markers, but I don't want to spend the time to learn that. I use a combination of brush pens and fine tip markers, but more often than not, I'll use the sharpies to do detail work, like any textured piece, boots, demons... really anything that I don't trust my hand to be steady enough for with a brush pen, since I tend to just use one size. If anything DOES bleed too badly... I usually go over the edge of the line with a white ball-point pen to clean it up.

As for paper, I don't know about how accessible art supplies are where you're living, but I'd say anything that's thick and isn't too fibrous should work. I use this paper, for reference: http://a.co/dYY9DPt
Image
User avatar
kayotics
 
Posts: 157
Joined: January 29th, 2018, 9:57 pm

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby TheJGamer » June 2nd, 2018, 1:10 pm

AltCat wrote:
TheJGamer wrote:-How long does it take for an Ultra Fine Sharpie to dry? Back when I drew with pens, I sometimes erased the pencil sketch too early, causing the pen lineart to be smudged, which is something I don't want happening.


Not tried a lightboard?

Apart from not having to erase of course, I find it also makes the sketching better since not thinking about being light on the hand instead.


The lightboard does look pretty neat. Doubt I'll be using it though, since it's pretty expensive, and I don't want to have to spend tons of money just to do something I like to do in my free time.

Also, I found this old pen in my house just now, which doesn't bleed but has the same properties of an Ultra Fine Sharpie! The pen seems to be a Pilot Hi-Tecpoint 0.5, from what I read on the pen label. Are those any good?
Just some kid who likes to draw and sprite. Thinking of starting a comic and actually sticking with it.
User avatar
TheJGamer
 
Posts: 172
Joined: October 17th, 2016, 11:16 pm
Location: USA

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby Oly-RRR » June 2nd, 2018, 4:15 pm

TheJGamer wrote:The lightboard does look pretty neat. Doubt I'll be using it though, since it's pretty expensive

There are multiple ways of making cheap lightboards on your own - from just putting a clip-on lamp under a glass surface (like an occasional table) to craftier instructions on building one. But true, you don't have to use it (I prefer to sketch lightly and ink right over it), just saying that you don't have to buy a pre-made one.

TheJGamer wrote:The pen seems to be a Pilot Hi-Tecpoint 0.5, from what I read on the pen label. Are those any good?

I haven't tried this specific pen but I used to use Pilot pens for drawing and still use them for writing and it's generally a reliable brand.

I think it comes down to this-
kayotics wrote:I think it just takes a lot of time and patience to learn to use Sharpies as a tool. I've seen people do gorgeous things with Crayola markers, but I don't want to spend the time to learn that.

You can totally make good art with supplies from a dollar store or a back to school sale, it just might be a more frustrating learning curve than with slightly pricier art student quality brands. But at the same time you don't have to invest into pricey pro quality tools until you're sure it's a hobby you want to stick with (or at all). :)

I still occasionally buy kids watercolour sets on sales even though I have a couple of trusty pro sets because each brand has a different combination of pigment and chalk and trying different ones is exciting somehow. :geek:

kayotics wrote:I usually go over the edge of the line with a white ball-point pen to clean it up

I haven't dealt with outward bleeding on my comic paper but I sure use a lot of white pens (and markers) to fix inking mistakes so yeah, that sounds familiar! :mrgreen:

kayotics wrote:I'd say anything that's thick and isn't too fibrous should work. I use this paper, for reference: http://a.co/dYY9DPt

Thanks for the link (I think you linked it before, probably in the Day in Webcomics thread)! I haven't seen that paper locally (and I prefer to avoid Amazon if I can shop locally at all) but I generally try to pick something thick and smooth. Currently using this (but in larger size). I still have enough of it stashed but I might try something new when it starts running out (it's so much easier to be adventurous with paper for doodles than comic pages, haha).

Not sure if I should take the rest of it to a different thread since it's not exactly answering the OP's question but this thread made me wish I found SJ's community earlier - I spent several years inking ENTIRELY with gel pens (and drawing the same line twice to add thickness), then I moved on to liners in a similar manner and all that time there were people telling me "you might want to try brushes, you might want to try nibs" etc but nobody actually explained the actual mechanics of tools and how gels pens are not very convenient if you're looking for a varied line and it's not just some fancy artsy "ew school brand pens" thing.
Image
Image
You can't compare shooting a stag with lasers to putting on women's clothing!!! - Liz Carr on Ouch!
You know you're overweight when your stab-vest starts riding up and looking a bit like a crop-top... - Alfie Moore
User avatar
Oly-RRR
 
Posts: 1887
Joined: August 20th, 2012, 6:36 pm
Location: here for the music

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby kayotics » June 3rd, 2018, 5:19 pm

Oly-RRR wrote:Thanks for the link (I think you linked it before, probably in the Day in Webcomics thread)! I haven't seen that paper locally (and I prefer to avoid Amazon if I can shop locally at all) but I generally try to pick something thick and smooth. Currently using this (but in larger size). I still have enough of it stashed but I might try something new when it starts running out (it's so much easier to be adventurous with paper for doodles than comic pages, haha).

I probably did link it before. I've never seen the brand that you linked before, but I have a feeling it's because we're in pretty different parts of the world. I definitely respect your desire to shop locally. I try to do the same thing, or at least avoid Amazon.

Oly-RRR wrote:Not sure if I should take the rest of it to a different thread since it's not exactly answering the OP's question but this thread made me wish I found SJ's community earlier - I spent several years inking ENTIRELY with gel pens (and drawing the same line twice to add thickness), then I moved on to liners in a similar manner and all that time there were people telling me "you might want to try brushes, you might want to try nibs" etc but nobody actually explained the actual mechanics of tools and how gels pens are not very convenient if you're looking for a varied line and it's not just some fancy artsy "ew school brand pens" thing.

Honestly, I was thinking the same thing just yesterday. While forums are a bit antiquated at this point, the forums here have been particularly helpful with all kinds of information.

Overall, TheJGamer, a lot of it is going to be trial and error to see if things work well with each other. I hope your new pens work out, or at least lead you in the right direction to find the right pens.
Image
User avatar
kayotics
 
Posts: 157
Joined: January 29th, 2018, 9:57 pm

Re: Ultra Fine Sharpie Inking Questions

Postby mitchellbravo » June 3rd, 2018, 6:36 pm

Re: Cheap lightboard- This doesn't work for extended drawing sessions so much, and also limits when you can do it, but if you've got some quick work to do, you can use a window on a sunny day.
oly: we draw stories about imaginary people
Image
Do not feet infants to honey under one year of age.
me: Posh, Baby, Sporty, and Scary Ham
robybang: Together they're Spiced Ham
User avatar
mitchellbravo
 
Posts: 6344
Joined: October 11th, 2010, 1:31 pm
Location: too tired


Return to Art Tutorials & Techniques

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests