Woops

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Woops

Postby beldon123 » January 21st, 2012, 2:52 am

So my school has a "prayer circle" that happens every Tuesday. Just a bunch of christian students get togeather in a cirlce around the flag every Tuesday morning and pray, no big deal. I may be an atheist, but it's not like I hate religion or anything. I'm not going to try and get the prayer cirlce thingy shut down. (though I'm not exactly sure if it's legal, what with it being on school grounds, but whatever) This will become important later on in the story.

So yesterday, I wore a shirt to school that had the atheism symbol on the front. No big deal, right? Well, apparently it is, as three, count them, THREE students complained to the principal that it was "offensive to christians". I was actualy called into the office about it, where I voiced my argument that, if they allow people to wear religious shirts and cross necklaces and have prayer group every Tuesday morning, I should be able to wear a dang t-shirt that expressed my beliefs. (in reality, I didn't even care about that "expressing beliefs" thing, it was just my only clean shirt that morning) In the end, my shirt was actualy CONFISCATED, and I was made to wear a spare that the school provided.

Again, as long as you're not trying to force your beliefs onto me, you could be a baby eating satanist and I wouldn't give a crap. (I'm actualy friends with a neo-nazi. Dude's a good golfer) But still, something about that whole thing was just agrivating.


I did get my shirt back at the end of the day though. I'm thinking of wearing it on Monday.
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Re: Woops

Postby corruption » January 21st, 2012, 4:53 am

Maybe you can claim religous persecution?

Tell them that if they insist on making an issue about it, they should have their lawyers look into the legality of the prayer circle, and any related issues.

If the school has a dress code, look into that. If your shirt does not clash with the code, go for it, ONCE you look into the details.
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Re: Woops

Postby blankd » January 21st, 2012, 4:56 am

Unless that shirt violates a dress code rule (ie: indecent exposure, contains profanity, explicit material, racism, etc.) they are not legally permitted to confiscate it. Refer to "Freedom of Expression" if you have to and Google the court case relating to freedom of expression. However if you are at a PRIVATE school of some form, their rules might be a little different, if it's public then what I previously stated should be valid.

As for them praying at the flag pole, it is not illegal to do if it is done by students. Teachers/Faculty are, by law, not permitted to teach, enforce religious practices or discriminate based on religion in the classroom (they are allowed discuss religion for educational purposes, but they are not allowed to preach it and such).

As for your... Neo-Nazi friend, well, uhhhhh............... I'm really hoping you're using hyperbole here.

EDIT:
Corruption, having a (peaceful) prayer circle is not illegal. 8|
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Re: Woops

Postby beldon123 » January 21st, 2012, 5:06 am

Public school, no problems with the dress code. Just a few people were "offended"

And I'm not kidding actualy, I'm friends with a neo-nazi. He goes to the street rallies and everything. He's actualy a pretty nice guy, (aside from, ya know, the racism thing) and that's one of the main reasons I'm friends with him. He's completely against the steriotype of nazis being violent, loudmouthed brutes. He's a very polite, well dressed, well edjucated young man who just happens to hate blacks and jews. He's more lenient on the gay thing than other neo-nazis though, apparently. I just like the idea that I can say "Yup, I'm friends with a neo-nazi. Who is he? The guy drinking coffee while reading Macbeth over in the corner."

That, and as I said, dude's a great golfer.


I'm not really in the mood for the whole "take 'em to court" thing. Seems like too much of a hastle. Though on the topic of teachers participating in the prayer circle; the math and government/world history teachers are the ones who started it last year.
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Re: Woops

Postby blankd » January 21st, 2012, 5:14 am

beldon123 wrote:I'm not really in the mood for the whole "take 'em to court" thing. Seems like too much of a hastle. Though on the topic of teachers participating in the prayer circle; the math and government/world history teachers are the ones who started it last year.

They're permitted to do so, so long as it isn't in the classroom or being used to actively discriminate against students.

They are allowed to practice their own religion, they simply aren't allowed to use the school's time/money to preach it instead of you know teaching whatever subject they're supposed to be teaching.
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Re: Woops

Postby beldon123 » January 21st, 2012, 5:16 am

blankd wrote:They're permitted to do so, so long as it isn't in the classroom or being used to actively discriminate against students.

They are allowed to practice their own religion, they simply aren't allowed to use the school's time/money to preach it instead of you know teaching whatever subject they're supposed to be teaching.



Does it count if they're on school grounds? 'Cause it's held around the flagpole in front of the school.
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Re: Woops

Postby blankd » January 21st, 2012, 5:22 am

beldon123 wrote:
blankd wrote:They're permitted to do so, so long as it isn't in the classroom or being used to actively discriminate against students.

They are allowed to practice their own religion, they simply aren't allowed to use the school's time/money to preach it instead of you know teaching whatever subject they're supposed to be teaching.

Does it count if they're on school grounds? 'Cause it's held around the flagpole in front of the school.

No, so long as it is peaceful it is permitted.

Unless the area around the flagpole is somehow a classroom and it is done during a class session (which I really doubt)
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Re: Woops

Postby beldon123 » January 21st, 2012, 5:31 am

blankd wrote:Unless the area around the flagpole is somehow a classroom and it is done during a class session (which I really doubt)


(insert laughter here)


Well, like I said, I'm not bothered by the prayer circle thing. I may think it's bonkers, but if that's what they want to believe, more power to 'em. Still, the "incident" with the t-shirt was quite a bit of bull-crap.
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Re: Woops

Postby Cave » January 21st, 2012, 12:17 pm

Wow, that is ridiculous.

I think you should totally stand up for your beliefs! Check out this recent happening from around where I live even. >_> The good news is though justice DID prevail in the end. (yay)

The aftermath was not pretty though: http://www.examiner.com/humanist-in-nat ... a-responds
http://www.examiner.com/humanist-in-nat ... ner-ruling

I find it funny that the people who were supposed to be following the prayer (and the Bible, Jesus, etc) were the most hurtful and hateful in all of this. :(

I hope they're able to get over themselves and accept everyone for who they are. I'm Agnostic myself so.... ><
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Re: Woops

Postby beldon123 » January 21st, 2012, 4:14 pm

Cave wrote:I find it funny that the people who were supposed to be following the prayer (and the Bible, Jesus, etc) were the most hurtful and hateful in all of this. :(



I'm not too surprised. Christianity (well, religions in general) have had a history of violence.
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Re: Woops

Postby blankd » January 21st, 2012, 4:31 pm

beldon123 wrote:I'm not too surprised. Christianity (well, religions in general) have had a history of violence.

Quoting this for irony, bold for emphasis.

You have your answer, take this issue up with administration and move on, don't use this incident as entitlement to start crapping on other people's religions; there are good and bad people of all creeds, never forget that. Generalizations are terrible, stop using them to perpetuate unnecessary unrest.

Saying that your clothing made them uncomfortable is hardly an "act of violence" no more than how (it reads like) uncomfortable you find people praying by the flagpole (and your strange interest in finding out if a peaceful act that has nothing to do with you is illegal or not). Yes it was likely an inconvenience for you, but get it taken care of and get over it.
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Re: Woops

Postby beldon123 » January 21st, 2012, 4:49 pm

Hey, I really don't care about the dang thing, I was just going with the flow of the conversation. And I never called the flag-folks violent, or said the t-shirt thing was an act of violence.
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Re: Woops

Postby Cave » January 21st, 2012, 6:43 pm

Sorry, I didn't mean for what I said to be taken like that. (Though I suppose you could call being bullied an act of violence).

I wouldn't like the situation to be blown out of proportion either. The students need to get over themselves or not be hypocritical. e_e If it does go too far though, you do have a case. :P
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Re: Woops

Postby Tex » January 27th, 2012, 4:58 pm

It just goes to show how much thought goes into decisions like these; not a whole lot. Though I'm not open about it, I'm an agnostic athiest.

Maybe I just hang around tolerant people, but nobody ever lets my belief influence their view of me, except for the hardcore theists who get mad at me when I start discussing my theories on god and the universe. They are rather touchy on those details, especially when what I'm saying actually holds some merit.

When authority figures let their bias influence decisions however, it shouldn't be tolerated. What happened to you is complete nonsense, and shows us just how hypocritical people can be.

"We should be free to express ourselves in public, but not the athiests!"

I had a teacher in a grade 12 religion class (I was going to a catholic school merely because of the wonderful teachers provided at that location) who was pretty open about his beliefs. He didn't mind people speaking out about their own beliefs and he was rather sharp in pointing out the flaws in his own religion, but if you argued moral issues with him...

..Ho'boy, you should have seen how fast he turned into a debating /machine/.

Smart man, not like the close minded theists you're describing. But I digress, I suggest you fight that little incident if you have the mind to do so.
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